If the latest census report is to be believed the Republican party and conservative movement will be close to a dead issue by 2042 when white guys are a minority.

“(e.g., that the United States is an inherently “liberal” regime) that nobody has actually believed in fifty years?”

No one believes that now? What? Actually the problem is closer to being that “conservatives” who are actually a form of liberal, think American is an inherently liberal regime and think that is something to be celebrated. They actually believe that that liberalism is conservatism. The only people who regularly question the America as liberal regime paradigm is some paleocons, some Christian Nation types and the far left (America was founded on the backs of slaves types.) What am I missing here?

What part of the conservative movement is worth saving is a good question. Being an adjunct of the GOP has to go. The default political pragmatism has to go. Mortal fear of being called politically incorrect has got to go. Etc.

In 2042, the Republican Party platform will include a plan for comprehensive reform of the US’s national health care program.  Republican Congressmen will engage in furious debate in an attempt to limit the penalties for discrimination against homosexuals to fines rather than imprisonment.

Anybody who really merits the moniker “conservative” had better prepare to be a revolutionary at this point.

You’ve got your dates wrong Doug. This is all scheduled to happen in 2013 under the Republican Joe Lieberman Administration.

SD:
“In 2042, the Republican Party platform will include a plan for comprehensive reform of the US’s national health care program.  Republican Congressmen will engage in furious debate in an attempt to limit the penalties for discrimination against homosexuals to fines rather than imprisonment.”

Sounds as if 2042 US Republicans will still be well to the right of our British 2008 UK Conservatives, then, who wouldn’t dare do either of those things.  Not so bad… >:)

As long as Obama doesn’t talk face to face with Iran we are safe.

Good article.
Since “conservatism” has become a conspiracy, er, network of trolls to promote unconservative agendas, I’d say, do away with it. But as long as money continues to flow in their direction who knows from where, there is little reason for them to go away. After all they make a handsome living by doing nothing other than expressing their lunatic ideas.

“In 2042… Republican Congressmen will engage in furious debate...”

What, all 6 of them?

The new definition of a “Conservative” should be carved in stone on a statue of our beloved Conservative President being pulled about in a little red wagon by the brilliant conservative strategist Rove. Then we might be able to decide if the so called “Conservative Movement” is worth saving.

That definition is , by the way;
Conservative; noun, 1. A well paid barking lunatic who feeds his or her supporters minds with all manner of counterintuitive fairy tales while taking the notion of being on the government dole to new heights before promulgating government policy that essentially guts the interests of the fools who support them.
2. One who spends other’s money with vigor and celebrates debt as something as American as Apple Pie
3. Someone who does not believe economics to be the “dismal science”...rather, it is not a science at all because it does not exist.
4. A Sociopath, see Neo Conservative.

Conservatism will slowly retake parts of the European social scene as the reaction to the EU sets in.  Europe has always been fundamentally more conservative and elitist where it matters most - social acceptance, mobility, distrust of Podhoretzian duplicity, and of course social aesthetics. 

By 2042, or 2012, America will be an unrecognizable Sambo nation of vulgar, troll-like fat people.  Half of New Yorkers already look like mestizo Hobbits.  No one will believe that ladies like Gene Kelly or Lauren Bacal or even Brooke Shields were once American people.  Take it from someone who lived in Latin America: our nation will be much uglier.  The GOP will essentially be some Medved/Ben Stein monstrosity, teaching Mexicans that George Washington was actually Jewish and that Plymouth Rock was the conscious prelude to the refounding Israel.

It’s interesting that a half-baked philosophy like libertarianism has hordes of very good (if not entirely sane) theorists, as does liberalism, while conservatives famously dislike serious thinking of any kind and thus have few good thinkers. And unfortunately, the ones they do have, such as Roger Scruton, tend to be shills for Thatcherism and neoconservatism, which is not what anyone can call thinking outside the box.

Mr. Bramwell wrote:  The Outsiders: Why is it that the greatest American conservatives—Joseph Schumpeter, Jacque Barzun, Jane Jacobs, Tom Wolfe—have had so little to do with the conservative movement?

Schumpeter was Austrian by culture.  Barzun was French born and carried his Gallic culture his entire life.  Jane Jacobs became a Canadian citizen so her sons could escape the draft.  Once Taki would have been severely displeased, but with this crowd of ninnies I am sure it elicits admiration.

Tom Wolfe???  What planet are you on?  Weaver and Kirk tower above his meager talent.

Jupiter, legal abortion and national health insurance hardly sound like a conservative program to me.

Jupitor: I have been in the prolife movement for 30 years and we don’t want to put women in prison just abortionists. All your arguments are red herings. Abortion and widespread contraception are the reasons the white race is disappearing.

There is no “conservative movement.” There’s a conservative establishment, which lives high
on the hog in both coasts and revels at compelling those in “flyover” country to observe
what they call “conservativism” but there is no movement. Movements are organic and spontaneous.
Ron Paul has a movement for better or worse. Conservativism has just deadwood rotting at
the core.

Thank you Jupiter for proving the paleo complaint about white nationalists.

Yes, we must save the white race, but not any of that ‘screwball’ nonsense about the sanctity of life. We just have to throw out the absolute consensus of Christians before the twentieth century that abortion and contraception are wrong. We get white people without any of their pesky civilizational quirks like decency, morality and Christianity.

We can end immigration and then die a slow national death because we do not replace ourselves. What a glorious victory.

Jupiter,

I should mention that I am retroactively against the Act and for its repeal and reversal. I do not doubt your figure, but again, it is not much a victory if we simply die out slowly.

I am not primarily concerned with large audiences at the moment, but right and wrong and the Christian tradition. These positions may seem harsh and are often unpopular, but the same can be said of many views. White nationalism, for instance, is rejected by many people when they hear the first word, but that is not a good reason to reject the view outright.

I am glad you acknowledge the seriousness of the abortion and fertility issues. It often seems that WNs are indifferent to both issues which is amoral for abortion and suicidal for fertility.

No, I do not want to pass legislation or otherwise use the state to outlaw contraceptives. I certainly oppose them and do not want one red cent of my taxes to fund them, but I do support such a ban.

My opposition to them may be “insane”, and if so I will gladly embrace the madness of my faith.

And that’s “do not support such a band”.

Jupiter,

I believe that a least a modicum of sanity inheres in the point you assert, to wit, that women who undergo abortions are not innocent bystanders.

However, I am troubled by the racist overtones of the case you make when speaking of abortions that occur post-rape. Also, more significant, your trying to draw a line between abortions performed after (black-on-white) rape and those coming after consensual intercourse—a line that, whether out of “principle” or expedience, many willingly draw—is morally unsound. Permitting abortion in this instance understand the only legitimate foundation upon which to base opposition to abortion, viz., personhood, by suggesting that, conceived by a (black) rapist, one child is less of a person than is an unwanted child conceived during consensual (white) intercourse.

Save your racist diction and your philosophical unsoundness for Stormfront, please.

No, the conservative movement should not be preserved.  It fact, if our people are to have a viable future, it must not.  It is a false opposition that drains off real struggle into a useless direction. 

It is said that we must talk about culture and not race because such candid talk ‘spooks the lemmings’.  Yet no serious thinker honestly believes that our culture is not a product of our unique genetic endowments, as Sam Francis observed and was fired for.

We are bid to speak in euphemisms and yet I think it is plain that most of our people are not listening.  Most probably don’t have the brains to ‘read between the lines’ (in fine Straussian fashion) anyways.  They are too anesthetized by their creature comforts and our degenerate, masochistic pop culture to give a damn.  All the while our people sleep the system lurches forward to third-world squalor and brutality if not out right collapse. 

This is the point of Buchanan’s oeuvre: no White race (this includes a mongrelized “White” race), no Western culture, no first-world standard of living.  The light will have gone out in the world.  Anyone who doubts this isn’t ‘reading between the lines’ and just doesn’t have a clue.

But if the only way to get our people to listen is to speak to them directly of the importance of preserving our blood and we are disallowed from doing this what hope is there? 

And why is it that we can’t speak directly to our own people about matters that rightly concern us and no other?  Why must we live in fear?  Why is it that candid discussion of such things automatically has the effect of ‘spooking the lemmings’?

Could it have something to do with an over powering, alien influence in our mainstream media that has pathologized any plainspoken expression of the interests of our people?

Yes, any serious thinker knows this is true, and yet we can’t say it for fear of being crushed by our enemies.  Richard Nixon and Billy Graham knew of what I speak and said so to one another on the Nixon tapes.  They, too, sold out our people out of abject fear just so they could preserve their careers (careers that were ONLY made possible by the collective efforts of the White masses)and keep the system lurching forward for a few more decades.

You see, its that media control that’s the thing, that is the head of the snake.  That is the opinion manufacturing mechanism that pathologizes (with filthy smears and lies that say more about the accusers than the accused) any honest attempt to peacefully defend the precious, precious life of our people.

We say we want to head off this looming disaster, a disaster that will force us to defend the life of our people by force of arms, yet we are bidden ‘play the game’ all the while the game is hopelessly rigged against us.  ‘Conservatives’ have been playing the game for decades and look where it has gotten us.  Precisely no where.

I am truly at a loss.  All I know to do is speak the truth and fear no man.  Not play squalid little games.  That and not bend the knee, EVER, not for any price.

The ease with which the late William F. Buckley morphed into a Zionist, and the eagerness of those Christian fundamentalists who drool over Israel while their Jack Daniels-guzzling pastors, with gold Rolexes flashing, roar from their pulpits about our obligation to defend Israel, demonstrate that the paleoconservative (lack of) movement defined itself by what it was not, rather than what it was.  Basically a rich man’s movement, it produced the dilletante Buckley and stuffed-shirt Regnery Gateway.  Do young paleos shout themselves hoarse demonstrating?  Do they allow themselves to get arrested blocking traffic?  Why, no; after all, they’re conservative.

Do young paleos shout themselves hoarse demonstrating?  Do they allow themselves to get arrested blocking traffic?  Why, no; after all, they’re conservative.

Posted by Roland Maruska on Aug 14, 2008.

I’m a young White Nationalist, not a paleo-con, and you just gave the reasons why.  My loyalty is to my blood-kin.  I am prepared to die for my people.  What White man of honor is not?

Well at least some modern people are willing to die for something.

I must ask, out of curiosity, why, apparently, no White Nationalists have names? Why is everyone anonymous? 

Prozius, Jupiter, and Captainchaos? I respect “Captainchaos“‘s desire to “speak the truth and fear no man,”, so why not start by using the name your parents gave you?

Jupitor: Three things have doomed the white race. The pill, the immigration act of 1965, and Roe vs. Wade 1973. There is never going to be a white redout. Go to Sweden, Norway, Denmark or England and see all the race mixing going on. The goal should be too get rid of affimative action and push for equal treatment. Thats the best we can hope for.

First of all, Jupiter, what was your mother doing in the basement of a hospital?

Second of all, Connie Francis, nor any other woman, should be in a motel room alone; where were her husband, father, brother(s), uncle(s), etc.?

In what way is it “conservative” to allow women to travel alone?  Or be in the basement of a hospital? Et cetera, ad nauseam.

Rapes occur because women are outside of a well fortified home or other such secured environment.  It is pure Enlightenment ideas of “equality” that get women raped, and abortions are the result.  Instead of fighting to allow White women to get abortions, why not fight the NEED for White women to abort their child of a [Black] rapist?

Go back to tradition, and these problems solve themselves.

Prozius, Jupiter, and Captainchaos? I respect “Captainchaos“‘s desire to “speak the truth and fear no man,”, so why not start by using the name your parents gave you?

Posted by Jeff Willbee on Aug 14, 2008.

You see, Jeff, I had some bigwig Straussian professors in college.  During our study of the classics it was brought to our attention that prudence is a virtue of considerable weight.  Prudence at this time dictates anonymity.  Got that?

The Straussians are not entirely useless to our people (HeHe!).

_________________________________
Jupitor: Three things have doomed the white race. The pill, the immigration act of 1965, and Roe vs. Wade 1973. There is never going to be a white redout. Go to Sweden, Norway, Denmark or England and see all the race mixing going on. The goal should be too get rid of affimative action and push for equal treatment. Thats the best we can hope for.

Posted by the original jack on Aug 14, 2008.

Low birth rates go with the territory of first-world modern society, jack.  Look at the Japs.  But, you see, this can be countered.  The National Socialists (Gasp! Did he say the...?) took measures to drive women out of the work force and back into the home, freeing up jobs in the economy for men.  They granted loans to women to have children, one fourth of which was forgiven for each child born.  Pretty nifty, eh?  Guess what, it worked.

The Japs should try it, and so should we.  One thing the Japs have going for them: no filth-column culture subverters who control the media, academia, finance, and the political system.  None of that pesky guilt and masochism to soften them up for better use as a host even though their war time crimes were great.

As for the hopelessness of a White redout: speak for yourself, defeatist. 

Just how high is the rate of miscegenation anyway?  According to the 2000 census less than five percent of Whites married non-Whites.  This is a large enough sample that I am confident it is representative.

This would not be the first time our people were replenished from a small, but hardy core: black plague anyone?  Protestants versus Catholics that exterminated two thirds of Germans?

No, my friend, pessimism of the spirit is not justified.  If our will is strong, we can win.

“Rapes occur because women are outside of a well fortified home or other such secured environment.” - Patrick Hall

Mmmm, and free-range savages have naught to do with this?  And who was it that was so instrumental in freeing them?  What group was it that founded the NAACP?  What group’s members made up most of the ‘freedom riders’?  What group’s members were the core of the Frankfurt School and ‘race is a social construct’ and all that?  What groups members were the core of the ‘New Left’?

Starting to catch on?  Meta-questions, my friend, meta-questions.  Small steps.

“The GOP will essentially be some Medved/Ben Stein monstrosity, teaching Mexicans that George Washington was actually Jewish and that Plymouth Rock was the conscious prelude to the refounding Israel.”

HA!.... ROFLMAO!!!.... Kudos!

I have to say that while I don’t agree with everything Jupiter has written, some of what he’s saying touches on Dr. Francis’ views how the paleos’ approach is counterproductive.  I do not agree with every position taken by Ron Paul, particularly with regards to trade and economics, but I like his view that abortion should be left to the states.  That would still mean doing away with pro-abortion legislation and funding.  I am more against abortion than Jupiter is and would not want it where I live, but his point that the current conservative approach to the issue is stupid was shared by Dr. Francis (right down to the charge that the more hardline rhetoric turns away people, especially women who could otherwise be good M.A.R.s—I’m not sure but I think that was the 1992 Chronicles).  I don’t agree with Jupiter that conservatives should abandon our stance against abortion altogether, but I thank him for highlighting how conservatives really need to change our strategy and tactics on this issue.

I feel have to comment again.

I, as a paleocon, do not put any of the blame or moral culpability of a rape on the victim. 

I would like to echo Mr. MacGarr, Dr. Paul and Dr. Francis, and say that I am a federalist/localist on this issue (and essentially all others). Jupiter is right to criticize social conservatives for their foolish, uncritical support of the Republicans and their wars.

“Conservatism, one would think, should have have something to do with the racial, cultrual,linguistic and ecological conservation of Euro-America”

Well yes. Even the strenuously non-racialist amongst the paleos favors three out of the four, and most of us realize that while culture and race are not completely synonymous, they are strongly linked.

Well yes. Even the strenuously non-racialist amongst the paleos favors three out of the four, and most of us realize that while culture and race are not completely synonymous, they are strongly linked.

Posted by Jeff Willbee on Aug 15, 2008.

What irks me about paleos is the overwhelming impression that I get is that many of them, if, damn it, they just HAD to choose, between their precious culture and saving their race the would choose their culture. 

Am I the only who thinks that is perverse? 

Of course, in the real world, those who are ardent culture preservationist but only half-heartedly want their race to survive will have neither if their race is exterminated.

I also want to add that if I were a leader and someone in my camp expressed Jupiter’s degree of racial determinism, I would say those are his views but he’s still okay with me and I’m not going to denounce him.  Then I would talk to him personally and tell him to publicly apologize not for his views but for giving anyone the impression that they are the exact same as mine.  But if someone expressed the view that a woman who goes out alone should expect to be raped, I would expel him from my campaign immediately and unless we’ve been friends for years, wouldn’t hesitate to denounce him loudly.  Then I would tell everyone else in my camp that if they have a problem with it, or would like to similarly disgrace my name, they can follow him. 

My point, directed at Jupiter, is that I hope you did not get the impression that it is part of the paleo agenda to blame your mother or even less fortunate women because they don’t fit into some Romantic image of a centuries-old age nobody remembers and likely never was.  The sort of woman you have in mind, clearly close to your own heart, is more valuable to our cause than such cranks. Sam Francis would not have disagreed for one second.

I apologize for that impression. My impression of White Nationalists is that they seem to be largely indifferent to culture. The more I talk with them, the less this seems the case however.

I, for one, am primarily a partisan of my culture. While I do feel a sense of fraternity with fellow whites, I also feel a sense of fraternity with my coreligionists and fellow traditionalists, no matter their race. And I don’t believe that preserving white people and preserving Western culture are mutually exclusive--it would seem that the White Nationalist would be the first to say that te later is largely an outgrowth of the former.

Well, if the quality of the comments posted above is any guide, then certainly there isn’t much of a bright future for non-conservative-movement-conservative-ghetto.

If Mr. Bramwell (whom I met at a Philadelphia Society meeting a mere four years ago!) wants to take his own advice seriously, why is he writing for Taki Mag? He should have tried to place it in an establishment outlet.

Of course, I think there is much truth in Mr. Bramwell’s diatribes against the “conservative movement” [incidentally, I am correct in thinking that the very word ‘movement’ stems for early 20th century Germany?].

But we’ve all read his long and thoughtful critiques of same in the American Conservatives. This doesn’t add much.

What I would really be interested in, is the following: we’ve had the “destruction” part, time for the “creative” part.

Is Mr. Bramwell still on the Right, politically (or does he think that too is a useless term)? Is he still a conservative? I see he is now not only opposed to the Iraq war, but also to tax cuts in the marginal rates and to the roll-back of communism.

What does non-movement-conservatism stand for? Where are Mr. Bramwell’s positive ideas instead of his criticisms of others?

The only interesting reaction I have seen to this article is here:
http://toryanarchist.com/2008/08/14/canon-fire/

To answer the question: No. Be sure to visit our site TheAmericanView.com. & comment.

LOL!!!!  I see Jupiter’s got his Nazi Tic back again.
Really, you guys at Takimag crack me up - alternately conversing like pipe-smoking Gentlemen at the Good Ole Boys Club and then frothing at the mouth like storm troopers.  Seriously, Jup, if you love the Euro of America so much, why the hell don’t you go back to the Old Country. Kudos for Cap’n Chaos for coming out and openly declaring himself a White Nationalist.

Jupiter,

I encourage you to check:

http://www.majorityrights.com

You seem like a smart guy who is capable of thinking outside the box.  Thats what “majorityrights” is all about.  This is not your father’s WN.

As a defense of myself, I’m not blaming the victim for her rape, but her male overseers and the culture/society at large that would allow a woman to be put in harm’s way.

As for “free range savages”, that, also, is the responsibility of the male members of the “civilized community”.  Rapes are directly related to the ability of a community to string up rapists from trees and lamp posts.  You don’t see much of that any more, thus you DO see a general increase in the rate of rapes.

“Rapes are directly related to the ability of a community to string up rapists from trees and lamp posts.  You don’t see much of that any more, thus you DO see a general increase in the rate of rapes.”

In contrast to some of Mr. Hall’s earlier statements, I find this agreeable and well put.

The conservative movement’s only purpose is to defend the partisan interests of the Republican Party. Between elections they occupy their time in jabbering about the Constitution, free markets, the culture etc. but then they’re back to supporting the Republican Party.

Is the conservative movement worth preserving? Is the Republican Party worth preserving...?

Sam Hooft above is right.  This got off course early and never got back on.  I would add that Mr. Bramwell should spend about 40 years growing up before he again writes such a puerile attempt at sarcasm.  He has insulted many of his betters, without offering anything that compares with their wisdom.  By the way, with Mr. Bramwell anointed to National Review’s leadership, isn’t it interesting that he doesn’t question the reasons that NR should continue to exist?

What group was it that founded the NAACP?  What group’s members made up most of the ‘freedom riders’?  What group’s members were the core of the Frankfurt School and ‘race is a social construct’ and all that?  What groups members were the core of the ‘New Left’?

Starting to catch on?  Meta-questions, my friend, meta-questions.  Small steps.

Posted by Captainchaos on Aug 15, 2008.

A few months ago I read a magazine article that featured a picture of a U.S. Marine who had returned from
Iraq.  He left major parts of himself there.  With one arm around his girl friend’s waist, he sports his new bionic legs.  Robo-Marine and his chick are wearing Pat Robertson Hallelujah!, Walt Disney cartoon-character (The Little Mermaid?  Alladin?  Mowgli?  Pocahontas?  They’re all the same.) Pepsodent smiles.  Why are they smiling?  They should be enraged, at George W. Bush, Dick Cheney and the Jewish neocons.  They will never again be able to enjoy normal sex.  If they have kids, he will never be able to engage in horseplay with his son, take him hunting or shoot hoops with him.  A friend recently said to me that the average American father prefers it if his son is an athlete rather than a scholar; thus we have the tragedy of all those athletic Christian sons losing life, limb and sanity in Iraq, courtesy of all the scholarly Jews who direct U.S. foreign policy.  I know what would bring an even bigger smile to Robo-Marine’s face:  the thought that his legs probably contain microcircuits manufactured in Israel, using technology stolen from American labs.  When Robo-Marine’s idiot’s smile turns into a snarl, when he goes to the White House, calls Bush a lying coward and throws his medals in his face, when he stands up in church and tells the congregation that the same people who sent him into harm’s way also put Christian Russia under the atheist Bolshevik boot for three quarters of a century, who are undermining our Christian values, who chose to spare the life of the terrorist Barabbas over Christ’s, and who are carrying out genocide against the Palestinians, then I shall know there is hope for our country.  Muslims our main enemy?  Hardly.  Hollywood is not in Baghdad, nor do the Muslims maintain websites devoted to ways to remove Christmas creches from public places.  No Christmas creche, no Menorah!  Tell them that in church, Robo-Marine, and show you have real courage.

Maruska,
Antisemitism is the conservatism of fools.

1) Leftist organizations attack Jewish displays. The antireligious crowd may include Jews, but the only thing that will save Judaism in America is teaching children to be Jewish, something they oppose as much as school choice for Christians.
2) “What group was it that founded the NAACP?  What group’s members made up most of the ‘freedom riders’?  What group’s members were the core of the Frankfurt School and ‘race is a social construct’ and all that?  What groups members were the core of the ‘New Left’?”
Leftists? Some of thiem were Jews, who helped undermine Judaism in every country these leftist scum exist. Go read “On the Jewish Question” and get back to me.

“courtesy of all the scholarly Jews who direct U.S. foreign policy.”
You mean the ones telling Israel to kill itself slowly through giving land to the Palestinians or the ones enabling the Muslim Brotherhood through the delusion if Muslim Democracy?

“.  I know what would bring an even bigger smile to Robo-Marine’s face:  the thought that his legs probably contain microcircuits manufactured in Israel, using technology stolen from American labs. “
I guess evidence is not a needed when slandering Jews.

“also put Christian Russia under the atheist Bolshevik boot for three quarters of a century”
Who? Lenin? Stalin? The German High command, which brogh the communists to Russia and funded and armed the October Revolution?
Or do you mean the Communists of Jewish ethnicity who banned Judaism along side Christianity?

“who chose to spare the life of the terrorist Barabbas over Christ’s”
Nothing like Medieval Antisemitism. Why not resurect the blood libel?
Besides, if a few Jews did not choose differently, there would be no Christianity.

“and who are carrying out genocide against the Palestinians,”
Geno-what? You mean like when under Israeli rule lifespan and population increased and they were the riched Arabs outside of oil-producing nations? Or perhaps you are thinking the Israeli Arabs too, who get out of military service, but get affirmative action. Some genocide! Idiot.

“Muslims our main enemy?  Hardly.”
I agree, leftists are.
But I think the people religiously motivated to conquer you area threat too.
And if you think otherwise, go Constantinople.

“Antisemitism is the conservatism of fools.” -RonL

Then you clean your own house.  Of late ‘we’ have bent over backwards to be gracious hosts for ‘you’.  And the above described is the ‘thanks’ ‘we’ get from ‘you’.  Thats right, if ‘we’ bear ‘collective guilt’ then so do ‘you’.