You’re a phoney, or worse a stooge Mr. Spencer.

Tell me about the scientific abilities of the “cultural” group known as blacks or sub-saharan Africans.

Laurence Auster - that other strangely inconsistent anti-middle-easterner recently exposed the failings of your anti-nationalist drivel re: the BNP.

If you must make the effort to convince us of something Mr. Spencer, why not try a little live-and-let-live. Stop trying to get us to look down on Arabs.

By any measure they’re better scientists than the negroes you insist we must live with. And by any objective moral measure they’re better than you and the negroes.

The “Rodney Stark” term in the article actually points to a book by Tom Woods. Rodney Stark has written some fascinating stuff on religion and sociology and is a specialist in this field. Tom Woods is a great writer and populariser, an a great advocate for catholicism, but he isn’t a specialist in the history and sociology of religion.

That “Fraud Spotter” is a wacky dude!

Speaking of which, whatever happened to “Peter Ramus”???

The psychology of sociopaths is sometimes formed by insoluble moral conflicts in their background that turns them into mad dogs.
For example the fact that Hitler’s grandmother was impregnated by a jew may have been the source of the familial pathology that led to his diabolical crimes against the jews.
I wonder what motivates Robert Spencer.
I hope whatever it is that is tormenting you Mr. Spencer goes away.
I hope you get well soon.

The case for the unique role of Christianity in the scientific advances in recent centuries is far stronger than that for the notion that Islam is uniquely barren. In singling out the Muslim people, as opposed to other stagnant societies, such as Chinese, Indians, Africans et alii, you display an agenda separate from the point seemingly advanced. By relying on the pseudo intellectual Zionist propagandist, Bernard Lewis, you identify your motive. This is a typical Jew toadying, hate effort, a cheap racist rant. The goal is to identify Christian successes with Israeli anti-Christian, anti-Islamic interests by singling out a single non-Christian community that just happens to be opposed to the Jewish project of genocide in Palestine.

Some serious confusion of memes here-
The current subsidy of the 1001 gadgets/ nights roadshow by wannabee technocrats in the UAE is indeed reminiscent of a Soviet All Technology Invented Here By Proleterians museum, but that is not to say Mendeleev didn’t devise the Periodic Chart.

The Frankish spectacles- likely a Venetian production in that century, represent two generations of technology transfer- Levantine glassmaking from its Syrian locus classicus to the Adriatic,and the elaboration of Helenistic optics ( remember the burning glass in Aristophanes’ play? ) by Islamic savants like al Hazen and al-Kindi who had Theophrastus and Hero of Alexandria in their libraries in Arabic or Farsi centuries before the Greek originals found their way out of Byzantium and into Latin.

The salient fact is that Islam’s technology edge rusted away along with its grasp of experiment as an aid to proto-scientific thought ossified along with exegetic flexibility as al- falsafa was suppressed as a pagan distraction from dogmatic theology.

As to the fella with Black Athena in his bonnet, reading a half dozen volumes of Needham’s Science And Civilization In China may (one can dream) persuade him that our lot were playing catch up from Charlemagne to the Tudors. The proverbial
Orient may not have kick started science , but it was in comparative terms a technology driven economic powerhouse on the eve of the Crusades.

The point of the article is not to make anyone look down on arabs.  Nowadays the left (especially in Europe) has this new mania about proving that anything scientific really comes from the Islamic World and not the Christian one.  The article seems to be a response to this tendency.

And it is hard to imagine consistent contributions to science from a religion which views God as irrational.  The Islamic world has made contributions to philosophy and science (Avicenna), but their contributions are enormously exaggerated to the expense of Christianity.  What we call modern science, even if it is more associated with atheism than Christianity, has its origins in the Christian cultural sphere.  It appears more logical that it is the outcome of a religion in which God is bound by rationality than one in which it is not, and unbiased history supports that claim.

You ask:

“Such assertions only highlight the discomfiture of those who make them. For if Muslims really did make innovations in aerodynamics, astronomy, and other fields long before Europeans did, what happened then? Why were the Europeans the ones who made use of these discoveries for technological advancement? Even if Copernicus (who came from a devout Catholic family and may have been a priest himself) was influenced by Ibn al-Shatir, which is not universally accepted, why didn’t Muslims make use of his insights the way Copernicus did? (For more on this, see Thomas Woods.) Al-Shatir died in 1375, just under a hundred years before Copernicus was born in 1473. Yet in that century, and in the centuries thereafter, Islamic astronomers did nothing significant with their coreligionist’s discoveries. If Islam contained the seeds of the high level of cultural attainment that the Islamic world enjoyed at its apex, why has it been unable to reverse its precipitous decline from those heights?”

Sir John Glubb OBE, CMG, KCB, and a convincing historian explains that the Arab Golden Age lost a lot of its steam when Baghdad, the Arab world’s wealthiest and most sophisticated city, was sacked by the Mongols.  Many a scholar was put to the sword, the libraries were burned, and even the irrigation canals were destroyed.

Something else to bear in mind is climate.  The planet’s climate changed in about 1400.  Until then, wine had been grown on Greenland.  It’s quite conceivable that the difference of a few degrees Fahrenheit in average temperature makes all the difference between a hard-working, prosperous, and educated populace and a desultory, poor, and ignorant people.  Compare Arkansas, Mississippi, or Brazil, in 1930 (before the A/C was invented) to New York, Boston or Philadelphia.

Why was Italy the leading scientific power in the early Middle Ages (Dante, Macchiavelli ,Thomas of Aquinas, Leonardo da Vinci, and others) and why did it lose its preeminent position?  Is it because Italian culture is a second rate culture as you argue about Arab culture?  Why is it that Italy most thrived roughly at the time when it had the most amount of cultural exchange with the Arabs?  Doesn’t this fatally undermine your argument?

I am not sure that Bernard Lewis doesn’t bring pre-conceived notions to his study of Islamic culture.  An acquaintance who saw him testify on Capitol Hill told me he was clearly out to lunch.

Rather than critique an exhibition that may or may not have been put to together too expertly, take the time to read wikipedia’s article on Islamic science.

Level-headed people like Will Durant and Alexander von Humboldt had nice things to say Islam and its contributions to science.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_science

The big difference between Christianity and other
religions and the societies they encompassed was not
so much science, but applied technology. Inventions that
made the common man’s lot easier. The greeks and the
romans could make great advances in astronomy, but to
the common man it made little difference. But a horse
harness that did not strangle the horse and allowed it
to pull extra weight made the workload of the peasant
lighter, and a water mill freed thousands of the
drudgery of handgrinding, or worse, of turning the grinding
stone by walking round and round (the Romans, being
of practical bent blinded the slaves who did it so that
they would not get dizzy).

With Christianity science stopped being a toy or a way
to dazzle others, and began to become a tool for better
living. The Middle Ages were a technological age.

Islam, not being Chrisitianity did not develop a culture
of technology, and thus could not take true advantage
of any advances in science it made.

The real goal of all this is to ease Westerners into their graves, to make genocide through immigration more acceptable by blurring the line between the embarrassingly innovative West and the backwardness of their new colonizers.  Trumpeting past Muslim accomplishments in science, real or alleged, is relevant only to making them more palatable as invaders, it is a ploy designed to convince its victims that their dispossession won’t be so bad.  The rest is just angels on the head of a pin.

A brief glance at this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_science_and_technology_in_the_Islamic_world#15th_century

should bury Robert Spencer’s racial venom. The 17th to 19th centuries when muslim societies were colonized and denied access to education still say the world’s first fight, rockets and tall buildings invented in muslim socites.
Today from pen pal to medicine to the world’s tallest buildings in Malaysia, or wonders of construction like the Tarbela Dam are the work of muslims.
The breathtakingly rapid mastery of state of the art missiles, nuclear technology and 4.5 generation fighters by muslim countries freed of colonial rule speaks for itself.
The 40 ft Rafah wall is an example of Judeo christian culture is an example of modern applied western morals and science and its tearing down is an example of applied muslim scince developed in the largest prison on earth, a further example of applied western political thought.
Spencer has the same problem as Hitler, something went wrong on the family tree.

Yes, by all means, let’s pick on the Muslims. They’re a safe target after all, since they don’t control our government, media or academe. I dare you to write a piece about our “elder brothers in the faith” and their guide to psychopathy known as the Talmud. Nah, you wouldn’t dare!

Heh, even the so-called defenders of the west break down & babble about the accomplishments of Muslims, just like a self-hating white socialist. Whether white-hating or Jew-hating, it all just ends up the same way for you guys, huh? Whites are truly screwed.

In any case, I’ll take a Muslim over a Christian any day, no matter how primitive.

“that just happens to be opposed to the Jewish project of genocide in Palestine.”

I like when you pretend to care about Arabs because you’re too coward to take on the Jews yourself. I enjoy watching you looking ridiculous.

While it is of more than passing interest to compare the various achievements of assorted cultural groups against one another, in the end, it is whistling past the graveyard.

Adriana is correct that the Middle Ages were a technological era. Far from “Dark” and despite the repeated plagues and factional warring, they were also the crucible of the Modern Western Nation State and with that, Capitalism and the Industrial Revolution. We could debate all day whether or not Christianity went beyond informing this technological progress to causing it.

At this juncture, the technological juggernaut appears set to run us all down a blind alley of diminishing returns, overpopulation, crowding, war and biologic crash. While our technology leapt ahead out of the Middle Ages, one wonders if our intellectual capacity, our ability to martial our technology with wisdom and indeed our spirituality kept pace. I do no believe it did. We are intellectually and emotionally way behind our technological abilities and quite likely will enter the same depauperate stasis that Islamic culture fully entered after the Ottoman Period, compounded by a kind of mechanized auto-destruct urge. Messianic Religious Revivalism is everywhere, a loud commentary upon the abuses of our financial, statist and technological systems when aggravated by overcrowding and resource competition.

Instead of comparing whose artistic and technological pudenda is biggest, we should be marshaling our reason, together with our spirituality in an effort to embrace historic human successes from whatever source they emerged from.....while pillorying the mistakes....and there are enough of those to go around on all sides..... so that we may finally achieve an intellectual mastery over our technological abilities. We trumpet ourselves as “modern” but are stuck in a primitive mind. Truth be told, this is the Information Dark Ages, an extension of the Middle Ages. We have yet, as a species to truly achieve the Modern we think we embody.

Imagery depicting the four cardinal points are found throughout all religions from the directional cruciform of the Algonquin to the Four Rivers of Paradise of Islam....among others. This unites us all.

Family.....Community....Spirituality....Labor/Craft....all converging and creating culture....the creative urge, our need to explore. In our rush to be triumphantly modern, we have forsaken this compass.

If we fail to overcome our reductio ad absurdum tribalism we’ll be reduced to eating the menu after the larder is emptied and no amount of spirituality will salve that sordid fate. Indeed, spiritualism will , by default, be proven a hoax at worst, an unmet potential at best.

Religio....the ties that bind, they blind us too often.

Robert,
You might want to continue your pursuit with further questions, that may well throw light to the difference between (some forms of) Christianity and (some forms of) Islam:  why was it that in Western Europe the center of innovations moved to north?  The industrial revolution happened in England, while the formerly progressive southern European countries became stagnant.  Also, do not forget that Europe had been “Christian” for over a millennium, before the southern countries began to flourish scientifically and technologically.  What changed here? 

Could it, for example, be that there are some seemingly very small changes in Christianity that have a disproportionate influence on the effect this religion has on sience and the adoption of technology?  Or might the reason be a political causality that is at best indirectly connected to religion?

The followers of Bedouin primitivism do everything but answer Mr Spencer’s question.

Wholeheartedly endorse Sabin’s keen insights into our moral hypocracy and backwardness.
The 18th century novel “Tom Jones” when compared to todays’ morals reflects that nothing has changed, we are the same hypocrite we were in the 18th century, essentially ignorant and guided by the satanic impulses.
The means of destruction have improved, the will to destruction has not changed an iota.

“His first flight took place in 852… (when he) jumped from the minaret of the Great Mosque of Cordoba. Though this attempt was unsuccessful, he continued working on improving his design.”

...painfully.

I was taught in Catholic high school that dissecting cadavers as was necessary to create the first comprehensive books on anatomy was forbidden by the Catholic Church in the Middle Ages, to protect the culture of life, and that the dissections that were necessary to make these tomes were done in secret.  This may explain why the Catholic monastic orders produced more than a few scientists in various fields, but no, or next to no, physicians.

The technology gap between the west and the colonies is closing fast:
This Jf17 fighter is a joint venture between China and Pakistan. The aircraft was developed in 8 years. It is comparable to the f16.
There is a message in the music here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aIyaJmgqGY
Here’s a comparison with the F16:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5aUGum2EiM&feature=related
The have come a long way since the jump of the minerat in Cordoba.
The Flamenco dancers still capture their passion don’t they?
Why are you perspiring Spencer?

Russian technology stolen by the Chinese and covered with pakistani paint is convincing proof that the muslim world is catching up with west.

Seems to me knowledge, such as sacred geometry, [astronomy] has been kept from the masses for some time given the Earths precession, which they knew of, is a 26,000 year cycle.

Adriana,

Thank you for your interesting posting ( they always are).

Dirk,

Thank you for bringing so much reason into the exchange. What a breath of fresh air.

Leonor.
http://www.diekunstlerin.com

Allen,
Pakistani input in the JF17 program has been entirely financial as the Chinese side had to be paid the full expense of developing and building the aircraft, seeing as the PLAAF had no interest in the plane as it already has the superior J10. I’m afraid the umma can claim no credit for this.

Stan,
As one who has spent the last 10+ years watching the Chinese aerospace industry, and more specifically the J10 your characterization was inaccurate in this instance, the JF17 uses Russian Satyrn RD93 turbofans and and the Pakis requesting the Italian Grifo 200 radar. The rest is Chinese. Allen is trying the dishonest rhetorical tactic of conflation in trying to connect East Asian technical achievements with Islamic achievements, or lack thereof. Science and engineering are quite well established in East Asian society today (China, Korea, Japan)
BTW Allen, China was never a colony, and they, not the muslims, did rocketry first. You cannot do rocketry without gunpowder. “Soviet All Technology Invented Here By Proleterians” indeed.

Ya Allen, what’s this weird obsession you have with trying to prove that Islamic countries have superior militaries to the West?

Hoping they’ll come liberate you from the Jews? LOL!

Information on the J17 program.

“The Pakistan Government had hoped to sign a deal to acquire 150 JF-17/FC-1 fighters in 2007, with 8 aircraft in service by year’s end. China had reportedly even bought 100 Klimov RD-93 engines from Russia for installing on JF-17s, with an option to contract another 400 engines.

There’s only one problem: Russia has just refused permission for the transfer of its RD-93 engines, derived from the RD-33 that equips the MiG-29. The decision comes only a few days after a visit to India by Russia’s Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Sergei Ivanov, during which a number of joint defense projects were discussed and agreements were signed. These include the MRTA transport aircraft, and reportedly a “5th generation fighter” project, even as the MiG-29OVT/MiG-35 is touted as the likely winner of the multi-billion MRCA fighter contract.”

The JF-17 looks like a cross between an F-20 Tigershark (never produced update to the F-5E) and an early model (Block10) F-16. We are talking 1975, perhaps 1980 here. It is an equivalent of the Chun-Kuo fighter built by the ROC/Taiwan.

The ChiComs can’t build any decent fighters by themselves, yet. However, they are co-producing Russian SU-27s and Su-30MKKs and these do concern me.
The ChiComs are building anti-ship missles. They are seeling alot of these as well to Iran and Hizbullah. Chinese anti-ship missles work. The INS Hanit, Israel’s most advanced corvette was hit by one. (Admittedly the Israeli navy were idiots and decided to turn off thier defense systems to allow for shore bombardment on an anti-aircraft ship.) Fortunately, it was either a small missle or the warhead failed to detonate. (This saved the British a few times in te Falklands conflict). Still that a Chinese missle got past electronic countermeasures is worrysome.

The PLA naval has rapidly advanced thanks to purchases from Russia and ex-Soviet states, French and Italian exports, and industrial and military espionage targetting the US and Japan.

Steve,
This is tangential to the main discussion, but do you have a citation for the observation of wine being grown in Greenland before 1400?  I have references to Scotland, but have never seen anything about Greenland.

Stan,
That WAS true, but Russia reversed itself (again)
(Courtesy of Richard Fisher 2007 Dubai Airshow Report)
“Since the Dubai show Russia’s Kommersant has reported that Russia has approved the Klimov RD93 engine in the FC-1/JF-17 for re-export to six countries: Algeria, Bangladesh, Egypt, Nigeria, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. Re-export to Pakistan had been an issue of serious contention between Russia and India, which uses the RD33, the basis for the RD93, in its MiG-29 fighters. Russia’s decision is a blow for Delhi, which will now face the JF-17 in significant numbers not only in Pakistan but also potentially in Bangladesh. China will also soon be able to arm the FC-1/JF-17 with 5th generation air-to-air missiles, such as the PL-10 derived from the South African Denel A-DARTER, and another radar-guided missile derived from the Denel R-DARTER. These weapons will greatly increase the combat potential of this low-cost but modern platform. At the same time, it is a major boost for Pakistan’s and China’s effort to promote the FC-1/JF-17 as the pre-eminent low-cost 4th generation multirole fighter. Until South Korea can market a single-seat combat version of its T/A-50 trainer, the FC-1/JF-17 will face no competition in its price range. The willingness of China and Pakistan to transfer full co-production capability will enhance the attractiveness of this fighter to many countries also looking to bolster their developing aerospace industries”
Ron,
Your information is about 15 years old. The Chinese defense industry has grown and developed very rapidly starting around 1994, and is now producing some interesting, though not yet leading-edge weapons platforms. As one watcher put it “this is not you father’s PLA”.
In the case of Fighter Aircraft they are now producing the J10, a kind of F16 on steroids, not the F22 or F35, but nothing to sneeze at either. The Chinese-manufactured SU-27s also have better fit and finish and lower friction than Russian-manufactured ones (the Chinese have better machine tools).
As for the Chinese anti-ship missiles, there is some confusion on the Hanit as to exactly what was fired, whether it was a Chinese-made C80x series missile or an Iranian copy, or what, nobody is willing to produce the physical evidence. In any event, the C-80x is fairly electromagnetic-resistant as it is largely independent of datalinks, unlike some cruise missiles like the Sunburn, which can be foiled by jamming the datalink to the ship. The newest Chinese weaponry in general now has more advanced electronics than anything the Russians can produce because Russia has so little domestic electronics industry.

The Chinese invited the Pakistanis in 1992/3 to joint-venture with them because they needed help with certain technical hurdles. The Pakistanis helped with concept, Avionics, and airframe design. They further inspired a modular approach to the project.
The result is a beauty that has better avionics and aerodynamics than the F16. It has already achieved a better power to weight ratio.
The engine is no problem, firstly Putin himself signed his agreement for the supply of the RD93 to Pakistan. The Chinese version has even more power.
The beauty in the concept is not only mdularity in the components permitting continuous improvement, but very simple field maintenance which makes it operationally user friendly.
Aseembly line production has already commenced in Pakistan. 4 Airforces have placed orders and another 10 have expressed interest. The Jf 17 does most everthing an F16 can including BVR etc.
It is the poor man’s F16. And yes The UMMA are very proud as this will confirm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhrNIdbzkwo

Yes Youtube was invented by a muslim too.
:)

Wasn’t it the Christian Monks who gave us
Ale, Lager and Scotch whiskey?
‘Nuff said.

you pose a very good question when you ask; if Muslims really did make innovations in aerodynamics, astronomy, and other fields long before Europeans did, what happened then? Why were the Europeans the ones who made use of these discoveries for technological advancement?

other questions can arise from that thought; what hath these europeans wrought?

what denomination shall we count? deaths, violence?

where do we go from here?

Willb,
God Bless the Christian monks for the ale, the lager and the whiskey.
Samuel:
You raise the right moral issue. For a brief couple of centuries, after colonization, the surplus from the colonies permitted some european countries to industrialize, this provided them military superiority that they used along with the kind of thing that spencer represents to justify colonization, oppression and genocide while they plundered the colonies keeping the natives uneducated and destroying their local industries. China was colonized by 6 european powers and it would take many books to describe even a little portion of that history.
Now the last dying embers of that mind frame are reflected in the attitudes of Bigots like Spencer, the Zionists and the Klu klux Klan.
That is why I mentioned the JF 17 Thunder. The west talked to the east with weapons, now the east is showing its not that hard to acquire them, and in the next 10-20 years they will leave the west behind. What will happen then?
Spencer says the notion of God in Islam is irrational and that leads to fatalism and backwardness. This kind of smoke screen is needed so we don’t think of the 40 ft wall in Rafah too much, and those 1 million dead Iraqis “were worth it”.
If we don’t expose this pernicious fifth column of Zionazi thinking and exorcise it soon, we may leave the masses with no choice but to fight fire with fire.

It’s scary to read these angry posts....all is hate hate hate, and it all comes down to religion in the end.  The funniest thing in all this is the plummet from the minaret and its perpetrator living to refine his plans.  Or had he invented the parachute as well by then???

I’m reminded of the song by cerrone : supernature.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgTciEyWaFE&feature=related

What goes around comes around!

How irrational is that Spencer?

If the Church was so welcoming of science, why did Copernicus withhold publication of his heliocentric theory until after his death?

If the Church was open to science, why did it burn Giordano Bruno at the stake for saying that Copernicus was right, and that the stars are like the sun?

If the Church loved science, why did it threaten Galileo with torture after he published his book in favor of the Copernicus and Bruno theory that the earth moves around the sun?

What do you suppose Galileo meant when, held in the dungeons, he said under his breath “Eppur si mouve”?

Religion, especially when it is coupled to the coercive power of the state, has always been opposed to science.

Enlightenment in Europe happened despite the Church, not because of it.

May the force be with you Cognate!

Remember the arrogance of the Pressler amendment inpired by the neocons. They decided that it was just fine to take $650 million from a poor countery and deny them the right to defend themselves. Here is how it played out at one level:

What goes around comes around!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhPZlUxtN1I

The creators of YouTube - a Chinese, a white, & a half-Bangladeshi/half-German who met at PayPal - don’t care if you live or die, Allen. They’d probably be the first to denounce your anti-semitism, being fully Americanized & paranoid about racism like most Americans. Now that’s funny!

In any case, they didn’t lose time selling their creation to the evil Jews at Google. No, Allen, the founders of YouTube will not liberate you from Da Jew.

I do hope that China or Pakistan colonizes you, though. That would be even funnier!

Mizrahet, exactly my point, Spencer aserts that one religion is irrational. My question: how irrational is that?
Think about it, he aserts that 25% of humanity believes in an irrational God?
So either he is a sociopathic zionazi, and you are applying for a job at AIPAC, or 25% OF HUMANITY IS IRRATIONAL. I humbly beg to state that you are an asshole.

Many people believe in irrational things. That is nothing shocking or new in the world. You, for example, believe that Pakistan will liberate you from your oppressor Jews.

Just because many people believe in stupid things doesn’t make it smart. That is herd mentality which appeals to people destined to be slaves, cattle, & mindless followers of dictators. You fit right in.

That said, Islaam is much more rational & suited to my heritage than Christianity. If I weren’t a Mizrahit, I’d want to be a Muslim.

But I’d still oppress you. :D

the powers that be have miscalculated for a long long time.
I pray god save you.

In my opinion, the difference in the influencing religious bodies plays as the factor in your argument.

Islam lacks a central church or governing body in comparison to Christianity which has been dominated by the Catholic Church.  The Catholic Church practiced collection of written work whereas Islam did not.  Granted, the Church was more preoccupied with finding heresy in the writings and limiting knowledge that may hurt the Church, but still it collected books from everywhere nonetheless.

My speculation is that the dissemination of the works by the Muslims scientists didn’t get propagated widely in their world, but these writings ended up in Catholic and Christian libraries where the ideas were plagiarized and taken under non-Muslim ownership.

“the powers that be have miscalculated for a long long time.”
The powers that be miscalculated that you’d wise up to the destruction of your country by Da Jew, brought about by glorifications of third worlders, primitives, and hostile elements. Then they calculated that impotents of your type are likely to look for Muslims to save you, thus continuing down the path of glorifying third worlders, primitives, and hostile elements. Guess you’re a hamster in a wheel no matter what.

“I pray god save you.”
Leave the prayers to God to me. You can continue praying to Ayatollahs, Pakistan, JF-17s, & a founder of YouTube. Rofl. You funny.

It’s a short jump from paleocon to Muslim bootlicker, if these comments are any indication. How pathetic is it that an ethnic group/religion has to lay claim to the inventions of others to boost its own worthless self-esteem? First the Africans, now Muslims. Next American Indians will claim the first moon landing.

“Wasn’t it the Christian Monks who gave us
Ale, lager, Scotch whiskey?
‘Nuff said.”

No, by the beer bill of Gilgamesh, they did not, witness the etymology of the alembics and other alchemical tools those worthy divines used to perfect whiskey, and thus justify the low opinion of metaphysics that gave rise to the Scottish Enlightenment.

It is a fearsome engine, your Alembic.

Re: “Da Jew”
Don’t you gentle folks read the news?
It seems we are in a gathering of the deaf talking to the dumb being wathced over by the blind.
Here is some recent news:
Last autumn in senate hearings it was confirmed that Pkistan had provided a “Nuclear Umbrella” to Saudi Arabia.
This obviously implies that Pk nukes are now within 5 minutes of Tel Aviv. This has effectively destroyed Israel’s ability to blackmail its arab neighbors or any one else that they will use nukes, because any way you war game it Israel gets wiped out.
This was followed by a campaign the the “media” that Pak nukes may fall into the wrong hands. And Bibi was assasinated in an attempt to ddestabilize the country (CIA?).
Then Liebermann went to Pak and met with the new army chief and the commander of the nuke forces, (Pak has over 250 nukes and 1000 cruise missles). This was followed by the meetin in Davos between Mush and Barak.
Bottom line “Da Jew” is begging Mush to not annihilate them. In the meanwhile China and Iran have made the strongest statements: hands off Pak.
If I were a betting man I would imagine that the Paks may be hinting that the occupation has to end. That is why Olmert sat there impotent as the wall came tumling down.
So Mizrahit don’t go buying any real estate in Tel Aviv in the near future.
That why I said “The powers that be have miscalculated for a long time”

That why I shall pray for “Da Jew”
Cause God seems to have taken sides here and he doesn’t seem to be on the side of “Da Jew”
P.S. Notice haow the media campaign on Paks nukes has gone silent.
You sick little morons!

What were we doing when the ignorant, backward and scientically challenged Paki muslims who follow an irrational god that tells them that it is pointless to resist, were putting a 1000 of these together?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pf6ZezPYFik&NR=1

So Spencer
How do you figure the muslims were able to get thir fingers on the trigger here. This looks like an ICBM to me.
Oh yes they got them from the Koreans.
So how come the Korean missiles keep failing and these never miss their target.
And how many do you think they have that they keep testing one every couple of weeks?
Don’t you think you owe your readers to tell them the truth. You may not like these people but the are definitely a lot smarter than you lead your readers to believe.
This one’s for you Spencer courtesy of those muslims who can’t seem to do anything right.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ercutt_NF28&feature=related

So Adriana:

Here’e a little proof that the muslims just don’t have the ability to apply science to any effect:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJNppgV7tFk&feature=related

Once again Mr. Spencer has announced himself as a person who allows hatred for Muslims to cloud his judgment. Nevertheless, the question of why and how natural science arose in the West is a deep and important issue. I would recommend that he begin with Owen Barfield’s “Saving the Appearances,” which connects the rise of science with the loss of participant knowledge. Certainly one of the key factors here was that the West forsook a religious attitude toward Nature. Look at Descartes, who thought that animals didn’t have souls - or Francis Bacon, who declared that we should put Nature on the rack and torture her secrets from her.
By contrast, philosophy in Islam, so far as I have understood it from the writings of Seyeed Hossein Nasr and other commentators on traditionalist metaphysics, never lost the sense of Nature as theophany, the revelation of God.
Furthermore Spencer assumes that modern natural science as it has unfolded in the West is the Last Word. But we will have to see. The pollution of the world and proliferation of wastes brought about by our technological proficiencies, will leave a very difficult world for future generations - who may indeed curse the natural science that brought it all about.
Finally, Mr. Spencer ought to remember that the Arabs invented the concept of the zero - which is an essential element in our computer technology.
I don’t think that Taki’s Last Drawer should be given over to the kind of anti-Muslim rants typical of Lawrence Auster and the people of the New English Review. This is not conservatism - it’s fanaticism.

Caryl:
Are you trying to get the boy fired by his ziocon masters?
Who will pay his rent?
Even political prostitutes have to live.
Additionally he provides agreat target and is an excellent teacher by negative example.
I say we need more of Spencer, just watch out for the STDs.

Hey Spencer if you are running short of ideas here is a subject for your next post:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgbRERYEQoY

PS: comments by viewers are interesting too:)

ROFL. Another white boy on his knees in front of darkies. Not even surprising anymore.

Yeah, Allen, I’m sure China is going to get into a worldwide nuclear war over Pakistani Muslims that even Saudis look down on. Dream on, son.

Oh, but I’m sure they’re going to get into a nuclear war to liberate white boys from Zionazi oppression. Look to the sky now, Allen, they’re coming to rescue you any day now. The nukes are just 5 miles away from Tel Aviv! Liberation is at hand! Any day now...Haha!!

I know, I know, it’s the only thing that gives you hope at night. You’re a useless coward & you know it, so you hope darkies will fight your battles for you. What a lack of dignity. No wonder no one respects white people anymore.

P.S. I can say darkie because I am a darkie. You’re not allowed, or you’d have the PC police at your door. Maybe if you beg hard enough, you can get the Chinese to ask the Da Jew to ease the PC restrictions on you in exchange for some weaponry.

Nah...it’s funny to see you squirm. :D

“the Roman Catholic church seems to have embraced the idea that Jewish people are its elder brothers in some kind of mystical merger of Judaism and Christianity.”

In spite of your stupid Ademic babbling, I agree with your dislike of this fictional concept of Judeo-Christianity.

Judaism & Christianity are at complete odds. Christianity is more a pagan European religion & all the Semiticness they stole from Judaism has long been watered down into nothingness. Any half-informed fool should be able to tell that Islaam is much closer to Judaism in mentality, outlook, core values, & even in daily rituals.

Furthermore, it is gross for Jews to side with Christians who have persecuted Jews for centuries against Muslims who have been good to Jews.

To Hell with Judeo-Christianity.

Ms Johnson:
Its 200 years too late to save the planet. The American Indians warned how the (judeo-christian) white man was disconnected from the rhythems of nature. The white man buried not only the native americans but the future of the world.
Today Zionist Boys like Spencer are baiting the muslim world and they will end up like the boys who were baiting Tigers in the Zoo in California.
Its too late to save this world when the U.S. public elect George 2 times.
The bottom line is that the Chinese are following the old war strategy of winning without ever firing a shot.
That is why they encouraged the U.S. to go into afghanistan to die by a thousand pinpricks. That is why after Liebermann’s visit, Gates is skipping Pakistan on his trip.
Its hard to talk when you are bleeding.
What goes around comes around.

Mizrahit,
Why did Liebermann go to Pakistan?
Why did the brave, heroic Israeli army stand by and let a bunch of strving Palestinians break down the great Israeli contribution to aestheic architecture?
Where is netanyahoo?
Is Sharon still dead?
Have you recently raped any Philipino slaves in Tel Aviv?
Have you listened to the Senate hearings on the “Pak-Saudi nuclear Umbrella”?
Have you taken your Lithium and Valium today?

Mizrahit:
Please don’t try to misrepresent what Muslims believe.
The believe in Moses and in Jesus, and they have placed Jesus on a higher Pedestal than any “Christian” ever did.

Jesus (Isa) A.S. in Islam, and his Second Coming
by Mufti A.H. Elias

I. Jesus (A.S.) In Islam

Muslims do believe that Isa (A.S.) was sent down as a Prophet of Allah (God), but he (Jesus) is not God or Lord, nor the son of God. Muslims do not believe that Isa (A.S.), also known as Jesus by Christians and others, is dead or was ever crucified. We believe that he was raised to heaven and is there, and will descend at the appointed time, end all wars, and bring peace to the world.  Like Jesus (A.S.), Muhammad (Peace be upon him) is also a Prophet and Messenger. Muhammed (P.B.U.H.) is the last Prophet, though, and there is none after him.  Hence, Islam is the last religion, complete, with the Holy Qur’an as the unchanged and perfect word of God for over 1400 years, as God promised to preserve it till the last day for all of humankind, unlike sacred texts of other religions which have mulitple versions and are “revised” periodically.  God, or Allah in Arabic, is Divine and Supreme Being and Creator.

What the Holy Qur’an says about Jesus:

They slew him not, nor did they crucify him but it was made dubious to them.
(Holy Qur’an, Surah Nisaa, Verse 157)

Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) himself told of the coming of Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him). In the Bible, Jesus (A.S.) says,

If you love me, Keep my commandments. And I will pray to the Father and He shall give you another comforter that he may abide with you forever.
(Bible, John 14-15/16)

But when the comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the spirit of Truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me, and he also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.
(Bible, John 15-26/27)

I have yet many things to say unto you, but you cannot bear them now. How be it when he, the spirit of Truth will come, he will guide you into all truth, for he shall speak not of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that he shall speak, and he will show you things to come. He shall glorify me, for he shall receive of mine, and he shall show it unto you.
(Bible, John 16-12/14)

Ulema (learned scholars in Islam) have said that the person who is described by Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) to come after him - in the above verse - does not comply with any other person but Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him).

In this case, the “comforter” he mentions is none other than Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and his laws and way of life (Shariah) and Book (Holy Qur’an) are those that Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) asks his followers to abide by.

The “person” whom Jesus (A.S.) prophecised will come after him, is called Pargaleeta in the Bible . This word was deleted by interpreters and translators and changed at times to “Spirit of Truth” and at other times, to “comforter” and sometimes “Holy Spirit.” The original Greek and its meaning is “one whom people praise exceedingly.” The sense of the word, then, is applicable to the word Muhammad in Arabic, since Muhammad means “the praised one.”

Jesus (A.S.) also says in the Bible,

... and a little while and you shall not see me; and again a little while, you shall see me because I go to the Father.
(Bible, John 16:16)

... and the Holy Qur’an says,

And surely they slew him not. But Allah (God) raised him unto Himself.
(Holy Qur’an, Surah Nisaa, Verse 157-158)

As such, Muslims believe that Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) was raised to heaven. According to Hadith, he is on the second heaven. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam=Peace be upon him) mentioned, “During the Meraj (Ascension), I met Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) on the second heaven. I found him of medium stature, reddish white. His body was so clean and clear, that it appeared as though he had just performed ghusal (ablution, cleansing of the entire body) and come.” In another Hadith, Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) mentioned to the Jews that, “ Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) is not dead, he will most surely return to you before Qiyamat (the Day of Judgement).”

May Allah Guide all people to the Truth. Aameen.

(For more information about Jesus A.S. in Islam, Click Here)

II. Hadhrat Isa’s (A.S.) Descension The Physical Features of Hadhrat Isa (A.S.)

He will resemble the famous Sahabi (A.S.) Hadhrat Urwa bin Masoodi (R.A.). He will be of average height and red and white in colour. His hair spread to the shoulders, straight, neat and shining as after a bath. On bending his head, it will seem as if pearls are falling. He will have an armour on his body. He will be wearing two pieces of cloth light yellow in color.

His Descension

He will descend on a Jamaat (group) that will be righteous at the time and comprising of 800 men and 400 women. The people will be preparing for war at the time against Dajjal (the anti-Christ). It will be time for Fajr prayers, and Imam Mahdi will be the Amir (leader). From the darkness of the dawn, a sound will suddenly be heard that “one who listens to your pleas has come”—the righteous people will look everywhere and their eyes will fall on Isa (A.S.). Briefly, at the time of Fajr, Isa (A.S.) will descend. When descending, Isa (A.S.)’s hands will be on the shoulders of two angels (according to another source (Kab Abrar), a cloud will carry him). On their insistence Hadhrat Isa will introduce himself. He will inquire about their enthusiasm and thoughts on Jihad against Dajjal. Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will descend on the eastern side near the Minaret in Damascus (or in Baitul-Muqaddus by Imam Mahdi). At the time Imam Mahdi will have proceeded forward to lead the Fajr Salaat. The Iqamat of the Salaat would have been said (already recited) and Imam Mahdi will call Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) for Imamat (to lead the prayer), but he (Hadhrat Isa (A.S.)) will instead tell Imam Mahdi to lead the prayer since the Iqamat of that Salaat has already been said for him. Thus Imam Mahdi will lead the prayer, and Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will follow him. After the ruku, he will make this statement: “Allah has killed Dajjal and the Muslims have appeared.”

The Killing of Dajjal (anti-Christ) and the Victory of the Muslims

After the completion of Fajr Salaat (congregational dawn prayers), Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will open the door behind him where Dajjal accompanied by 70,000 Yahudis (Jews) will be. He will indicate with his hand to move away between him (Hadhrat Isa (A.S.)) and Dajjal. Dajjal will then see Hadhrat Isa (A.S.). At that time every Kafir on whom the breath of Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will reach, will die. His breath will reach up to the distance of his eyesight. The Muslims will then come down from the mountains and break loose on the army of Dajjal. There will be war, Dajjal will retreat, and Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will pursue Dajjal. Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will have two flexible swords and one shield with him and with these he will kill Dajjal at the Gate of Hudd. He willl show the Muslims the blood of Dajjal which will get on his shield. Eventually the Yahudis will be selected and killed. The swine will be killed and the cross broken. People will revert to Islam. Wars will end, and people will return to their respective countries. One Jamaat (group) of Muslims will remain in his service and companionship.

Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will go to Fajr Rawha and perform Haj or Umrah (or both) from there. He will also go to the grave of Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) and present his greetings and Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) will reply. People will live comfortable lives. The wall of Yajooj and Majooj (Gog and Magog) will then break.

III. The Blessings of Hadhrat Isa (Jesus) (A.S.)

1 Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will descend and stay on earth.
2 His descension will be in the last era of the Ummat.
3 He will be a just ruler and a fair judge.
4 His ummat will be the Khalifa (deputies) of Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam).
5 He will act himself and instruct others on the Qur’an and Hadith (Shariat/Tradition of Islam).
6 He will lead people in Salaat (Prayer).
7 He will stay on earth for a period of 40 years after descending. The will be the best era of the Ummat after the first era of Islam.
8 Allah will protect his companions from Jahannam.
9 Those who will save the Deen of Islam by associating themselves with Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will be amongst the most loved by Allah Ta’ala.
10 During this period all other religions and mazhabs besides Islam will perish, hence there will be no kuffaars (non-believers) in the world.
11 Jihad will be stopped.
12 No Khiraaj will be taken.
13 Nor Jizya (protection tax) money from the kafirs (non-believers)
14 Wealth and property will be in surplus to such an extent that there will be no one to accept the wealth of the other (everyone will be independent).
15 Receiving Zakaat (Alms-giving, Charity to poor) and Saadaqa will be discarded (as there will be no poor to receive them!).
16 The people will love the sajda (prostration to God) more than the world and what it consists of.
17 All types of Deeni (religious) and worldly blessings will descend on earth (many halaal (lawful) things will be created).
18 There will be peace, harmony and tranquility during the time of Hadhrat Isa (A.S.)’s stay in the world.
19 There will be no animosity for a period of seven years, even between two persons.
20 All hearts will be free from miserliness, envy, hatred, malice and jealousy.
21 For a period of forty years no one will fall ill or die.
22 Venom will be taken out of all venomous animals.
23 Snakes and scorpions will not harm anyone to the extent that if a child put his hand in its mouth, he will not be harmed.
24 Will animals will not harm anyone.
25 If a man will pass a lion, he will not be troubled or harmed, or even if any girl will open its mouth to test if it will do anything.
26 The camels will graze among lions, cheetahs with cattle and the jackals with goats.
27 The fertility of the land will increase to such an extent that even if a seed is planted in a hard rock, it will sprout.
28 A pomegranate will be so huge that a jamaat will be able to eat it and the people will use its peel as shade.
29 There will be so much barakaat (blessing) in milk that a camel will suffice for a huge jamaat, a cow for a tribe and a goat for a family.
30 In short, life will be most pleasant after the descension of Jesus (A.S.).

His Marriage, Death and Deputies

After his descension on earth, Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will marry. He will have children, and he will remain on earth 19 years after marriage. He will pass away and Muslims will perform his Janaza Salaat and bury him net to Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam). (Tirmidhi)

from: Hadhrat Esa (Alaihis Salaam): The Truth Revealed
and Major Signs of Qiyamat
by Mufti Afzal Hoosein Elias (May Allah reward him for his work in producing these kitaabs, aameen.)
from the original (with references): “Aalalaat-e-Qiyyamat aur Nuzul-e-Eesa.”

White boy, don’t tell me what Muslims believe. The only Muslims you’ve seen are a few people commenting on YouTube. I’ve met literally 100s of Muslims, lived with Muslims, eaten with Muslims, laughed & cried with Muslims, even fallen in love with Muslims. Been to nearly every Muslim country. Stay in your own hemisphere.

Saying that Muslims put Jesus on a higher pedestal than Christians is almost as idiotic as hoping that Palestinians will save you from Da Jew.

Jesus is a prophet that gets the respect due to any other prophet, but not as much as Muhammed. Worshipping men as gods, whether Isa or Muhammed, is blasphemy. Concepts of trinities & other pagan ideas are even more alien.

Seriously, knowing that you must beat your string bean over terrorist videos, you MUST have heard their opinions of Christianity at least once. Seek out the latest video of Azzam al-Amriki for a critique of Christianity.

I know you think you have much in common with the darkies, white boy, but deep down you know that no one likes your ass over there. Ya getz no respect, pork-eater. :)

Here is what muslims believe about Jesus and the virgin Mary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGhcgiO5hCs&feature=related

We must end “judeo-Christian” claptrap.

@ Allen (John Allen Muhammad?)

You didn’t factually dispute any single statement made by Mr. Spencer.  If you are trying to be an apologist for Islam, you aren’t exactly succeeding…

“Why did Liebermann go to Pakistan?”
To try to impose stupid & useless concepts of democracy on failing Pakistan like a typical clueless American.

Oh, wait, you thought he went there because Musharraf wanted to negotiate lifting some of Da Jewish Boot currently on Allen’s pencil neck? Hahaha.

“Why did the brave, heroic Israeli army stand by and let a bunch of strving Palestinians break down the great Israeli contribution to aestheic architecture?”
Because no one cares if Palestinians break into Egypt. Let white people needlessly die in other people’s conflicts. Middle Easterners are too smart for that.

“Where is netanyahoo?”
Oppressing you.

“Is Sharon still dead?”
No, but when he kicks the bucket, he’ll still oppress you while you sleep.

“Have you recently raped any Philipino slaves in Tel Aviv?”
No, just white boys named Allen. More submissive. He’s already used to being raped by Muslims. :D

“Have you listened to the Senate hearings on the “Pak-Saudi nuclear Umbrella”?”
Good, make the Persians sweat some more. No skin off our backs.

But what they definitely didn’t discuss was liberating Allen. Again. Poor thing. All that choking on Muslim manhood for nothing.

“Have you taken your Lithium and Valium today?”
Who needs drugs to feel good when you can kick castrated Allen around for fun?

Take heart, the Muslims are coming to rescue their favorite little eunuch any day now. Any day now!! Just keep clicking on YouTube!

Hahahahahaha.

“We must end “judeo-Christian” claptrap.”

Dumbass cattle go from swallowing garbage about Judeo-Christianity to swallowing garbage about Christo-Islaam.

You just have no respect for your heritage or yourself, huh? Always need to attach yourself to better people than you.

You are destined to be a slave & you deserve every bit of it. I’m loving it!

Mizrahit:

Christ said: Forgive them O Lord, they know not what they do.

He was too kind.

That is why Pak nukes are 5 minutes away from Tel Aviv. We have decided to avenge Christ!

Yep, the Pakistani Christ nukes are only 5 minutes away from removing Da Jewish manhood from your ass & inserting Da Muslim one.

No one can say Muslims & Jews aren’t brothers in Abraham. They even take turns! :D :D

Hey Mizrahit:

It was nice knowing you.
This may be the last thing you see.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXvf2khze_Q&feature=related

Ya Allen al-Gharbi, videos of missiles don’t scare me. Save that for frightening other eunuchs like yourself. Mizrahim are not cowards like you are. We would never allow either Jews or Muslims to walk all over us & threaten us like you do. We worship no foreign races. We answer only to God. We don’t beg other races to fight our battles. We’d rather die than be dishonored. All these are foreign concepts to you, I know, but they are the wave of the future. Keep jerking off over YouTube videos & looking for a Pakistani boyfriend, while the rest of the world points, laughs, & leaves you behind.

P.S. Christ hates you. :)

Afterwards there is silence.

The unmanly silence of the worm-like Allens of the world who hide behind their computers while others take care of business & fight.

Your type is doomed to extinction. & good riddance to that. No one will mourn your Holocaust.

Not even Christ.

Mizrahit, we did take care of business and we do have you by the jugular, you are beginning to sound like a chicken before its head gets unattached.

Yes, linking to videos on YouTube is indeed “taking care of business”—for the type of rootless, cultureless cowards who now infest the west & bring it to ever lower levels of dignity.

Kind of like how you’re reduced to supplicating from one Jewish master to a Muslim master, begging for help against the other one.

You have taken care of no business. You have fought no one & you never will.

How does it feel to be so helpless? So impotent? You know you can’t fight the Jews, so you hide behind other’s skirts like a frightened woman. Talk about a chicken. Bwak bwak!

How does it feel to know that your future is in the hands of others & others will make the decision as to whether you live or die?

How does it feel to live on your knees?

I’m loving the view from up here, habibi. :)

I realize sadism is more than an acquired taste with zionists like you, but seriously you need to worry about your future, and maybe run off to Russia before Hezbollah gets your mamma.

Hey mizrahet:
The judge says the Israeli army got its arse kicked by a couple of hundred Hizbollah.
So now you want to take on a million strong Iranians and 700,000 paks with nukes, and you think that mexican conscript visa hunters are going to do the trick, wow you are one fucking optimist.

You wish you could be a sadist. Like Hezbullah. Like the mullahs of Iran. Like the Israelis.

You wish you could fight Jews.

But you’ll never dare.

You’re forever stuck being a wannabe terrorist. Failed soldier. Little man.

You have no dignity. You are nothing. You get respect from no one. You were born to live on your knees.

It burns you, doesn’t it? Open wide & say, “COWARD”. :)

Leilah sa’eedah, little man. Wake me up when Hezbullah comes to liberate you. LOL!

Mizrahits are Belly dancers and singers who try to copy Arab belly dancing.
They often go to dance for arabs in the UAE, for a few dinars.
This one has probably been to more than a few all nighters with some rough Beduins. Thats how come she strings all these words together, stuff she heard on her knees comes to her mind most readily.
Check them out at Wikipedia.

Mizrahim = coolest people on the planet followed by Bedouins. :)

Filipino monkeyboys = sex toys of Saudis & Gulf Arabs. Permanently in a rage over being the footrests, cum dumpsters, punching bags, & personal slaves of their Arab hosts, even though their submissive asses convert to Islaam as soon as they step foot in the desert.  Generally seen walking arouns stooped, toothless, & braindead after being beaten senseless by whatever sheikh owns them. No such thing as the ummah, khenzeer. Next time, try marrying an old American pedophile for a visa. :D

Speaking of old American pedophiles, Allen is available & right in front of you. Peel those rags off & start dancing for your green card, boy!

Let no one say that Mizrahim aren’t helpful. LOL.

In the annals of honorable wars when Battle Tanks start up the go 60 miles into enemy lines before stopping for cofee and gas.
The Israeli “battle Tanks” went 200 yards into Lebanon before being blown to bits by a few good men.
So Mizrahi did you dance for them before they went or did you dance for them when they came back with Body parts missing?

I danced a little celebratory jig after successfully hooking you up with a hairless filipino monkey. Now you can masturbate to a real live boy instead of beating your meat to videos of missiles on YouTube. He’s been passed around by half the ummah, it’s true, but beggars can’t be choosers.

What can I say? I have a good heart. ;)

Aw, cheer up. The nukes are 5 minutes away from Tel Aviv! They’ll save you from Da Jew any day now!!

That is cool Mizrahi, the filipino monkey is a mossad agent, (a mizrahi) so please use some and pass it around.

I’m not surprised that you’re attracted to Mossad agents, as you seek out your superiors to protect you, whether Arab or Jew. The filipino is just a monkeyboy unfortunately, but if you dress him up like a mujahideen, you might feel safe from Da Jew tonight.

Mizrahim being helpful as always!

I’M COMING TO EAT YOU, WHITE BOY! MWAHAHAHA. *EVIL*

Hey Mizrahi/Mossad:

Before you eat me digest this first:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKQqItZu4Is
There will be no war crimes tribunal for you in Nuremberg, we will give you justice right here in Tel Aviv.
Do You like Palestinian music?

War crimes tribunals are for white boys who faint at the sight of blood & at the sight of Mossad agents. Everyone else either takes revenge or dies.

“Do You like Palestinian music?”

I like all kinds of Arabic music, but I’d have to say Moroccan is my favorite. Falestin dance the best debkeh, though. (In my opinion)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Im3KyOFN3wU

So Mirzahi, which one would you like to suck on first:
This:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoI6vZLv3Mo

or would you like to sit on this on your way back to Russia:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ercutt_NF28

Take your pick, the free lunch is over.

Hitler as 25% Jew would qualify for an Israeli Citizenship, no?
Just like the Neo Nazis you imported from Russia?
Ps anytime you need to get some counseling, let me know.

The free lunch is never over as long as there are millions of white boys to exploit & steal from! Have fun cleaning up the mess Da Jew left behind & dying in Israel’s wars. :D

Hitler is welcome in Israel as all white boys are, including you! Somebody’s gotta do the slave labor around there, eh?

When you’re done, you can go sweep Gaza.

P.S. It’s funny ‘cause it’s true.

FEE FI FO FUM, I SMELL THE BLOOD OF A SCARED WHITE BOY!

Hey Mizrahi:
Thanks for your being so candid.
Thanks for showing us what it is all about.
Please think of these people before you bring on the next holocaust.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpUC45vugdY
We don’t want to hurt you either.

Yep, Allen, your destiny is to be a slave to some kind of Semite. The type of Semite may change, but your role remains the same.

You’re the first in line for the next vague Middle Eastern war. Pack up your tampons & get moving. Yes, you can bring the monkeyboy.

Sweet dreams.

WATCHU TALKIN’ ‘BOUT, WHITE BOY? WE FAKED THE HOLOCAUST! MWAHAHAHAHA.

These guys eat lamb and venizon and there is a lot of testosterone brewing here, and they see the videos of dead Palestinian children everyday:
Mizrahi belly dances may not be enough to give them satisfaction:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgTciEyWaFE
God help you

They eat lamb? I didn’t know Pakistanis ate white boys. Good to know.

WE PROVOKE PAKISTAN INTO A WAR TO SEND WHITEY TO HIS DEATH FIGHTING PAKISTAN! MUSHARRAF IS MOSSAD AGENT! MWAHAHAHA.

Ok, You got me, Mush is a mossad agent, BUT these boys are NOT.
Mush will go in the next few weeks then you will have to make music with these guys;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aIyaJmgqGY
Did you make music like this recently?

Musharraf’s replacement is Mossad agent, too. Will the evil of Da Jew never end?

Save us, Hezbullah!

WE LIED ABOUT PAKISTAN NUCLEAR PROGRAM LIKE WE LIED ABOUT IRAN’S! EVEN YOU BELIEVE IT! WHITEY IS SENT TO HIS DEATH TO DEFEND ISRAEL AND INDIA AND KILL INNOCENT PEOPLE. MWAHAHAHAHA.

Mizrahit:

Mush is the last of the Mossad agents, trust me the rage is white hot.

The future is bright, the world is progressing and no one can reverse this general trend!

PS send me a link to your belly dance.:)

ONLY NUCLEAR WEAPON IN PAKISTAN IS FROM ISRAEL! WE FRAME PAKISTAN! FUTURE IS BRIGHT WITH NUCLEAR GLOW FOR INNOCENT PAKISTAN! MIZRAHIM BELLY DANCE ON WHITEY’S GRAVE! MWAHAHAHHAHA.

Don’t panic yet, Allen. I heard there’s a nuke just 5 minutes away from Tel Aviv! Liberation is at hand! LOL.

Hey Mizrahi:
Don’t scare yourself. The Paks knew every plan the Israelis made with the Indians to build the wall in kashmir, to take out Pak nuke sites, they knew all your little schemes, the drones they shot down within inches of the border.
So what happened? The Indians massed 1.1 million troops on the border for a year and never dared to fire one bullet. They dispersed when the desertions became a carnival.
So now what one false move and the paks will give nukes to the Iranians to take care of business. and remember the Paks do have the Chinese PLA anytime they need a hand.
When liebermann goes begging its a sign the times are a changing.
Sleep well nothing will happen tonite.

Ya Allen, we will save you from Da Jew if you & the filipino monkeyboy do a Mizrahi belly dance for us first!

What’s this, whitey can’t dance? Guess you’re on your own with Da Jew! Ma’ah Salaama!

INDIANS WON’T ATTACK, WHITEY WILL DIE INSTEAD OF THEM! PAK NUKE SITES ARE FAKE! PAKISTAN IS FRAMED LIKE IRAN. ALLEN SPREADS ISRAELI LIES THAT PAKISTAN HAS NUKES AND ACCUSES IRAN, TOO! ALLEN IS MOSSAD AGENT OR JUST GULLIBLE WHITE BOY! MIZRAHIM, START THE BELLY DANCE OF DEATH! MWAHAHAHAHA.

Hoo boy.  “Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelt of elderberries!”

http://youtube.com/watch?v=9V7zbWNznbs

Copernicus based his treatise on the works of Aristarchos, a greek astronomer from the island of Samos, whose heliocentric theory had been in obscurity for centuries under the influence of Ptolemaic astronomy.
The Arabs (which, btw, is not to say “all muslims") contributed much on numerics, algebra, chemistry and philosophy and should they stay on those, they can save themselves much ridicule.

Since Islam is being discussed here, I wanted bring this: Message to America from Imran Khan.
I trust this message will help some of us put Spencers’ opinions in the context of the wars being waged against muslim countries by Bush on behalf of a delusional neocon ideology.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=journeyman+imran+khan&search;_type=

Copernicus lived 5 or 600 yaers ago. Who he cheated from in his finals is moot.
If we could put him on the rack in the basement of the Basilica we may get the true answer, (or one we want), but do not despair, Rumsfeld has sent out a team of (what we got) to find him and take him to Gitmo where we will get the answer, at last. Don’t forget this is the ideological war of the 21st century. John Clease is a Taliban agent sent to sap our will. Hold tight and don’t let the bugs bite.
Mohammad (peace be upon him) said words to the effect: seek knowledge even if you have to go to China to acquire it.

Since we are soooo concerned about scientific development here is an example of APPLIED: numerical systems, arithmatic, decimal systems, algebra, sacred geometry, astronomy, physics, applied chemistry, metulurgy, geography, military science, binary systems and up yours, neocons:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgTciEyWaFE

Hey congressman, you passed the Pressler amendment to prevent them from getting your evil science, now they are selling it to your clients. What are you going to say to the workers who used to make F16s????????????
Hey Congressman Pressler, we are waiting for your next amendment.

Here is whaat the chinc coms made of your last one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhPZlUxtN1I
Zionism or Bust.??????

All these innovations attributed to “Islam” were actually Persian inventions and discoveries.  Almost all of the sciences in the muslim world were in the domain of Persians.

---
“…It is a remarkable fact that, with few exceptions, most Muslim scholars…in the intellectual sciences have been non-Arabs…thus the founders of grammar were Sibawaih and after him, al-Farisi and Az-Zajjaj. All of them were of Persian descent…they invented rules of (Arabic) grammar…great jurists were Persians… only the Persians engaged in the task of preserving knowledge and writing systematic scholarly works. Thus the truth of the statement of the propher becomes apparent, ‘If learning were suspended in the highest parts of heaven the Persians would attain it"…The intellectual sciences were also the preserve of the Persians, left alone by the Arabs, who did not cultivate them…as was the case with all crafts…This situation continued in the cities as long as the Persians and Persian countries, Iraq, Khorasan and Transoxiana (modern Central Asia), retained their sedentary culture.”
---
-Ibn Khaldour, medieval Arab historian

Why didn’t the middle east adopt and advance on these innovations?  Because it was annihilated by the Mongol horde.  What you know as Iran today is approximately half of the original country, the north eastern half being completely wiped out and supplanted by Mongolian tribes (Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan [birthplace of the 8th century Persian inventor of algebra, al-Khwarizmi],and southern Kazakhstan, were Iranian before the 13th century).

The largest city in Iran, Rey was transcribing 40,000 books a year in the 1200’s.  This abruptly stopped when the Mongolian tribes wiped out every man women and child in Rey.  Even the birds and cats were killed.  Tus, Iran’s second largest and most populous city, and birthplace of the great Persian chemist Geber, was also completely wiped away of all life.  Iran’s two largest cities, annihilated in five years, so completely that they were never rebuilt.

Amin:
Your argument is well taken. Please don’t forget that the Mongols destroyed much of Persia but were unable to stop the progress of Islam.
Their descendents converted to Islam, conquered India and established a mighty empire there 500 years ago, when Spencers ancesters were still living in the family tree.
The Mughals had a powerful Persian influence and this is manifested in the emergence of the “Urdu” language which is part persian and part sanskrit.
Great South Asian poets wrote much of their poetry in Persian.
Great expressions of the learning fostered in this era are there for all to see. The Taj Mahal, and the Badshahi mosque were buit by people who knew a thing or 2 about geometary, mathematics, physics, aesthetics and culture inspired by islam and Persia to a large extent.
Their

...Their big weakness was to assume they were so powerful that the few whites who showed up and prostrated themselve were allowed to trade and formed the east india company. This led to 200 years of suffering with few parralels.
The neo mongols have now attacked Baghdad and destroyed the greatest legacy mankind had dating back to paleolithic man and the bronze age. The museums were sacked, what could not be stolen was destrued, ancient arceological sites were bombed back into sand. The scientists teachers and doctors were systematically assasinated while some survivors escaped to other muslim countries.
Next Persia was to attacked again.
Their crime was to demonstrate that modern science can flourish and oretake the wwest in a few years in a “fundamentalist” muslim state.
That is why you have hacks like spencer ranting that muslims cannot make progress.
The only reason Iran has not been attacked is that the neo Mongols seem to have bit off more than they can chew in Iraq and Afghanistan, and are positively choking on Pakistan.
persia is doing the right thing by insisting that they have as much right to advance scientifically as the neo mongol pagans who have hijacked 2 great religions and turned them into the most diabolical philosopies ever in recorded history.

The muslims invented and deployed rocket science 150 years before the Nazis discovered it for the West.
Whether in science or architecture, or the art of governance or warfare or chivalry, the basic fact is that for any 10 year period you care to pick up from muslim history there is always a muslim standing head and shoulders above the rest.

Look Here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipu_Sultan

And here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9dbFPDa-Z4

The only reason they never conquered Europe was that there was nothing of value there to justify the effort.

It turns out that The world was circumnavigated by a Chinese Muslim General almost a hundred years before Cristabul Colon:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gavin_Menzies
He came bearing silk, porcelain and gifts of knowledge, not small pox and genocidal intent in the name of the Bible.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zheng_He

----Amin:
Your argument is well taken. Please don’t forget that the Mongols destroyed much of Persia but were unable to stop the progress of Islam. -----

I’m sorry Musafir, but the truth is that the Ottoman Empire of Turkey and the Mughal empire of India are but shadows of what existed in Iraq, Iran and Central Asia before the genocide of the 13th century.

What was lost is unimaginable.

Amin:

“the truth is that the Ottoman Empire of Turkey and the Mughal empire of India are but shadows of what existed in Iraq, Iran and Central Asia before the genocide of the 13th century.”

Agreed! Its relative though, both the Ottoman Empire and the Mughal Empire, were centuries ahead of “Christian Europe” in the development of modern civilization.
It is only after the treasures looted from India, China and Latin America provided the surplus that permitted
industrialization in Eurpe that we were plunged into a new dark age in the late 19th and the 20th centuries. This period has been charecterized by endless wars and the development of evil ideologies in Europe.
The good news is that it has shaken the muslim world out of its complacency, the still born “unipolar” world order has brought us to a new nader. Within the next couple of decades anew multi-lateral world is emerging. In this new world dynamic muslim countries like Iran, Indonesia, Turkey, Malaysia, Pakistan and many others will again help civilize Europe and the other neo Mongols.

I too Musafir share your optimism for the future and ultimately do believe that the world will develop for the better.

I don’t think it’s fair to call Europeans “neo-Mongols” though.  The Mongolians systemically killed off the indigenous populations of central asia and replaced them with their own people.  The Mongolian tribes deliberately destroyed the irrigation networks around Baghdad to make life uninhabitable there for generations to come.  The Europeans had ample opportunity to do the same but it is not in their cultural DNA to engage in such indiscriminate malevolence.

Amin, I can’t help see some analogies from the point of view of the sioux, the Incas and hundreds of native tribes of north america, that have disappeared without even a trace left that they ever existed.
The Mongols destroyed irrigation systems, The U.S. and Israel have been destroying electricity plants and water pumping plants and sewerage plants and milk plants and olive plants and using cluster bombs and depleted uranium which i suggest is more barbaric than most stuff the mongols did. The also invented nazism and zionism, going above and beyond the call of duty from even the mongol point of view. If you coun t the casualties of their wars of the 20th century they make the mongols look positively amateurish wannabes.
We definitely have probable cause here for a trial or two.

---Amin, I can’t help see some analogies from the point of view of the sioux, the Incas and hundreds of native tribes of north america, that have disappeared without even a trace left that they ever existed. ----

While the European massacres of Sioux, Incas, Aztec and other tribes were indeed morally reprehensible, it was qualitatively different than what the Mongolians carried out.  The intent of the European colonists was more to subjugate the native tribes, than to wipe them out.  Most natives died from Old World diseases, rather than armed conflict.  The Mongolians systemically carried out a campaign of extermination against a civilization that was more cultured and literate than their own. 

In contrast, when the Europeans had the martial advantage and colonized China, they could have carried out mass genocide to permanently remove a potential future threat, as they could have on countless other occasions, but they did not, for they realized that destroying a rich and deep civilization like China was an inexcusable crime against the humanity.  Europeans have had nuclear weapons for the last 50 years, and could have totally killed off all the peoples of the middle east, they have not.  You can’t compare that to the Mongolians, who in their one moment of martial advantage, wiped away the Iranian civilization of Central Asia and severely depopulated Iraq and Iran proper.

Amin, I hear you and respect your revulsion of the Mongols.
It is said when they conquered Delhi, no 2 bricks were left standing, one on top of the other, no people survived and no birds were heard for months.
So that is exactly what the neo Mongols did in Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
Your basic muslim compassion is making you project your own humanity on people who have repeatedly shown, they believe in “in group loyalty, out group contempt” just like the Mongols.
The Buddhist Vietnamese forgave and forgot agent orange. The Afghans and others in the neighborhood are descendents of the Mughals. I hope they will find it in their hearts to forgive like the Vietnamese. But don’t count on it.
The same applies to the Iraqis.

BTW:
One of the boys who dropped agent Orange on Viet Nam is running for President and promising One hundred years of WAR.
It is my sad duty to sanity to report that neo Mongols are around and flourishing right here in the USA.

America had nuclear weapons and dropped two of them on Japanese cities in 1945, killing 100,000, and ending the war.  The Mongolian tribes had swords and composite bows and killed over 10 million in the muslim world, completely eradicating the Iranian civilization of central asia.

Any way, we can agree to disagree.  I will never agree that American imperialism is akin to the genocide of the Mongol horde.

Tim and Stan:
This news report describing how Pak airforce users and engineers took over the project and are responsible for the end result you see, as weel as the 4 key drivers of the project:

The JF-17 project
By Ali Abbas Rizvi
2/8/2008
The JF-17 Thunder is a light combat aircraft, a single-engine fighter with all-weather capability, which Pakistan has developed with the help of the Chinese. It is a third-generation fighter that has been so designed that it can take on the fourth-generation fighter aircraft. The JF-17 fighter project would soon see serial production at the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, Kamra. In this connection, a ceremony was recently held at the aeronautical complex, presided over by the chief of the air staff, Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mehmood.

According to the JF-17 project director, the PAF will not only be the user but also the manufacturer of the JF-17 aircraft. Therefore, the manufacturing and production process of the aircraft will be monitored and controlled by the PAF from the very beginning.

The story of the JF-17 Thunder, to say the least, is rather amazing. The origins of the programme lie in the Sabre 2 project that the Chinese Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) had started with the American Northrop Grumman in the late Eighties. Following the Tiananmen Square issue in 1989, the Americans pulled out of the project. In came the Russian Mikoyan OKB. Pakistan received the invitation to join the party apparently in 1995, but it took four years to finalise the Air Staff proposal for codesigning, co-developing and co-manufacturing with the Chinese government. From that point, there was no turning back. In fact, to meet the fighter gap that the PAF was facing because of the American embargoes on F-16s, the Pakistanis, to a large extent, took over the project from the Chinese. In this respect, reports say that the specifications of the project were changed to include the PAF’s request for incorporation of the capability to fire beyond visual range (BVR) missiles following the induction of Su-27s by the Indian Air Force.

The underpinnings of the JF-17 project can be traced to the following factors.

First, the Pakistan Air Force has developed over the years a strong engineering base. In the early days of the service, engineering officers were sent abroad for training. The establishment of the College of Aeronautical Engineering at Korangi Creek during the mid-Sixties was a major step towards developing a team of professionals who could provide a strong engineering backbone to the service. The appointment of Colonel John H Blakelock from the United States Air Force as the first principal, and other American officers, who served till 1978, offered the much-needed impetus to the system of education at the CAE, which was developed on the lines of the United States Air Force Institute of Technology. The curricula it offers in both aerospace and avionics engineering is accepted worldwide. The CAE graduates, who have a hallmark of talent and professionalism, have helped to meet the rapid advancements in aviation technology and increasing complexity of PAF equipment. They have also made a significant contribution to the JF-17 programme, successfully dealing with different technological issues. Without them, meeting the Pakistani requirements and specifications for the JF-17 programme would not have been possible.

Second, it is safe to assume that the success of the Karakoram-8 jet trainer programme, which was carried out with the Chinese prior to the development of Thunder fighter, provided the thrust for the JF-17 programme. The lessons that were learnt from the K-8 programme regarding programme management, project designs, project monitoring, system integration, acquisition of technology from abroad or indigenous development, among others, were most likely put into effect in the JF-17 project, which is far more complex in nature and requires greater labour and technological input.

Third, while the training system of the Pakistan Air Force imbues a strong spirit of confidence, audacity and initiative among the officers and the airmen, what we see from the two joint ventures with the Chinese is that unnecessary risks were not taken. Instead, with regard to the two projects, good judgment, common sense and logic prevailed. The emphasis was not on producing the world’s best weapons system; rather it was on turning out a practical weapons system which could meet the requirements of the two services. Accordingly, instead of the aim being the most sophisticated top-of-the-line systems, it was kept in mind that a practicable and cost-effective technology could produce the desired results.

Fourth, the PAF has certainly followed the Indian Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), or Tejas (Radiance) programme, and kept its failures in mind while working on the JF-17 project. The Indian LCA programme is now approaching the fourth decade of its operation. The initial operational clearance of the LCA project, which was sanctioned in 1983 to replace the MiG-21s, has now been pushed back to mid-2008 while it could be joining the Indian Air Force in the years beyond 2010.